1740 and All That

Authors: selenak, cahn
Original discussion: https://cahn.dreamwidth.org/200007.html?thread=4252999#cmt4252999

selenak: So, at fail fandom anon, they have this "am I the asshole?" meme where a fictional (usually emotionally clueless) character asks this question in universe. I thought this was made for the Hohenzollern (and many of their social circle), so, here we go:

I, m34, was just trying to look out for my bratty younger sibling, m20 - there's this hot guy, total prick tease, whom the brat is swooning about. I might have said the guy has STD and made fun of his everything, and now the brat isn't talking to me anymore, when I was just being concerned for his health! AITA?

I, f55, always wanted the best for my children, especially when it came to their marriages. Now my oldest daughter looks at me as if I'm a madwoman just because I told her she should treat her new husband like her brother and not have sex with him so we can still annul this wretched marriage she should never have agreed to in the first place! She knows how much this means to me, and yet she betrayed me this way, she should be grateful I'm still talking to her at all! AITA?

I should have known this would happen, but: here I am, making some money on the side while providing heroic beta-reading services and writing my own stuff and defending an unfairly attacked guy against a shitstorm - and what happens? The guy who's been hitting on me for 16 years before I finally agreed to move in with him all of a sudden leads the shitstorm, attacks me while he's at it, burns my latest masterpiece and has me arrested while complaining to all our mutual friends that IATA!!!!!

cahn: Now my oldest daughter looks at me as if I'm a madwoman just because I told her she should treat her new husband like her brother and not have sex with him so we can still annul this wretched marriage she should never have agreed to in the first place!

omg, lol SD! I am going to say, YTABPAC, an acronym I just now made up that means "you're the asshole but possibly also crazy" :) Because when you put it like that...

As for your third one, he got some replies:
(just to be complete, for mildred:
ESH = "Everyone sucks here"
YTA = "You're the asshole"
NTA = "Not the asshole")

RandomRedditAddict
I can't help thinking there are a heck of a lot of missing reasons here. How is that you "should have known" this would happen? It's a little hard to say without more details, but I'm leaning ESH on this one.

MyActualNameIsGreaterThanThis
YTA. RRAddict's post above has a great point, missing reasons galore. Maybe you were really mean and annoying and made fun of this poor guy behind his back, whose only crime was thinking you were amazing?? And, like, are you kidding me, people don't just get arrested for NO REASON. I bet there was totally a reason, like maybe you STOLE his stuff!!

selenak: So here I, m, am, having a long term affair with the love of my life (m), procreating in my marriage (with f), having an affair with a bimbo (f) on the side, and mentoring this guy who has admittedly exciting future job prospects in my non existant spare time - and then that utter bastard first has sex with the bimbo, then, when I complain about it, dumps me as an mentor! I'll never get over it! His mother totally agrees with me, but the jerk still refuses to apologize - I don't need to ask whether AITA, because I know I'm not!

Here I, m64, was, enjoying my retirement as a PRIVATE CITIZEN, mentoring a few promising young people both in my state of residence and state of (former) employement, when it occured to me that takingon one more young fellow as a protegé might result in a general improvement of affairs for a great many people due to the kid's future job prospects. Now I was intensely familiar with people in his future line of work and let me tell you, most of these are jerks, with a lot of people suffering for it. His father was one of the worst. Any improvement there was enough of an incentive to lure me out of my retirement. Now I might have used a few questionable methods at first, but those prostitutes could use the money, so could various male friends in his social circle, and also, the competitition did the same thing. For a while, we seemed to hit it off and he expanded his intellectual horizon by listening to my reading tips, but unfortunately, the combination of other influences and an admittedly ill advised photobombing let to an enstragement. Well, at least I got a golden knob for a walking stick out of it, but when the kid, once on the job, immediately initiated a hostile takeover of the worst type, I couldn't help but wonder: could I have prevented this? was I the asshole there?

I, m, am a good looking career guy who used to be a in a steady relationship with someone in the same profession. Okay, my superior, but not the ultimate boss. (Could have had him, too, back in the day, if I'd wanted.) Now, maybe I was a bit high-handed when treating most of my s.o.'s hangers-on as the parasites they were, but I was just looking out for him! I mean, we've been through years of a high stress situation together, and now that's over, he's dumping me for some younger bit of fluff? Am I supposed to take that lying down?!!!! Of course I raised holy hell, I mean, who wouldn't, and okay, maybe hitting on his wife wasn't the best tactic, but I know he's been wanting to divorce her for eons. Anyway, the point is: I've been transferred to the back of beyond while the himbo got a gorgeous estate, and I still don't know how that happened. AITA?

I, m, really want everyone to be happy, and can't help it if many of them hit on me. I also want a steady job. Somehow, this evolved into a situation where this woman whom I had pay my travelling expenses thinks we'll live together while the guy in whose house I lived is having a fit because I had dinner with her on my last evening in town. But did either of them get me the job I wanted? They did not! So what's to complain about? AITA?

Some years ago I, m, and my long term companion, f, agreed to put our relationship on a non-sexual footing. AT the time, I thought it was a good idea, what with me being often ill and also way older. Since then, however, I discovered that I still can enjoy sex with a different woman. This doesn't impact on my relationship with my long-term companion, right? I mean, since we agreed to go platonic anyway, and I'm still as attracted as ever by her mind? It's just, there's this good looking younger guy hitting on her these days, and it looks like she's attracted to him, and I can't see that going anywhere good, so I said so, and we had an almighty row, especially after she found out about my other relationship. Okay, maybe I shouldn't have said "it's not like we're married" or "ditch the he-man, he's just after your money", but was that a reason for calling me a love rat and an overrated hack?!? AITA?

I, m41, am a loving family man with a strong work ethic and good Christian values. All I want is for my family to share those, especially my oldest son. To that end, I appointed him the best teachers, ensured he's always supervised and thus does not feel neglected, and spared him the awful stupid lessons I had to endure as a kid. Like Latin and ancient history. All I want in return is for him to be exactly like me, is this too much to ask? But no. He keeps grimacing when I'm around, ridicules all I hold dear, keeps lying to me, gets into debts and in general shows every sign of becoming the kind of lazy slob bound to ruin my life's work! So naturally I took counter measures. Some of them might have been drastic, like sending bad influences away and dragging him in front of two armies, but they were for his own good! Anyone could see that! And now the kid has humilated me in front of Europe by trying to run away, even conspiring with my own employes in order to do so. I might have overreacted when telling his mother he was dead, slapping his sister and telling him his mother doesn't care anymore, but I don't think so. It's just, my other kid, who's usually good as gold, now doesn't want to join my favourite profession anymore. AITA?

cahn:

DerAlteD
NTA. Kid should be more grateful. Maybe the problem is that he doesn't really see how much you do for him. I bet more family time would help, bring him to your nights out with the guys or whatever you do for fun. Or find him a nice girl! That's what he needs. Bonus is that your other kid will see all this and realize that the male authority figures really do know best.

pastorb
Depends on what you mean by "bad influences" -- I hope you're not trying to totally cut him off from his friends, that would be YTA territory for sure.

BearsAreNotTheAnswer
YTA. I just feel like if someone wants to run away, then that's your answer right there, you know?

mildred_of_midgard: According to Krockow, Kaphengst had a reputation for hard riding when he was alive--have breakfast with Heinrich, ride out to try his luck with women, be back in time for supper and sex that evening--and so even into the 19th century, the locals had a sort of "Wild Hunt" tradition about him: in late autumn, when the leaves had fallen, and a wind came to stir them up, the locals would say, "Kaphengst kommt."

I think this is a Fontane story, but I would have to check.

selenak: It is indeed Fontane based, from the Heinrich part of the Wanderungen. Which means it could be true - Fontane did a lot of research, for that book, including interviewing the female Kattes of his day, remember, and the Comtesse de la Roche-Raymon as an eccentric old lady - but it could also be novelistic embellishment on his part, like the scene where Hans Heinrich meets child!Hans Hermann mirrored by Hans Heinrich bringing Hans Hermann's coffin home. I mean, the book is a travelogue, not a scientific academic oeuvre. This said, I have no reason not to believe it, and it's entirely compatible with the impression contemporaries had of Kaphengst.

prinzsorgenfrei: I asked a friend about this and apparently her grandma, who went to school in that region, still says "Kaphengst kommt". I think it's hilarious and will attempt to use it in day to day life now :'D

mildred_of_midgard: So Fontane was not embellishing! That's awwwesome. I agree we should help keep this tradition going!

selenak: I have now lost the struggle to rein in my inner twelve year old pointing out the double meaning in "Kaphengst kommt". :)

Aaaaaanyway, it's great and amazing this tradition went on for so long. Also, I'm reminded of thinking when I learned that among the state guests who were staying at Meseberg in the last two decades was Vladimir Putin: Well, I hope Kaphengst haunts the homophobic bastard with graphic memories!

A mnemonic aid to remembering which Heinrich boyfriend is which.

selenak: [Quoting Lehndorff] "In pagan times, they would have made him a god, in our time, all who know him build altars to him in their hearts."

cahn: except all of Heinrich's actual lovers Awwwwwwww!

selenak:

Marwitz: You try building altars to the King's younger brother when the King is looking over your shoulder the entire time. Go on. I dare you.

Reisewitz: Look, I swear I did adore him. Okay, so I was the first to spend lots of his money in dubious ways, but look at all the gardening I did at Rheinsberg! Also, I offed myself when the debts grew too many. Because I was sorry.

Lamberg: He dumped me for goddamn Kalckreuth. That put an end to any altars right then and there.

Kalckreuth: I could have had the King, I'm sure of it, and I picked Heinrich anyway. That was mighty generous of me. Also I was the true military genius. And I gave him an excuse to separate from Mina. What did I get? I mean, other than lots of presents and promotions through the war. I got dumped for Kaphengst! Of all the indignities.

Kaphengst: I put a portrait of him on the wall of the nice country palace he bought me. Does that count?

Mara: You don't get anywhere with this prince if you don't behave like a bastard towards him. #canon

Tauentzien: I don't know about altars, but I did get him to watch contemporary theatre, starring his brother.

Antoine de la Roche-Raymon: Heinrich was the best, and I adored him. Why Lehndorff wouldn't believe I did, I have no idea. #finalguy